Dialogue, Rishi Valley, 20 December 1980

Krishnamurti: Most of you have heard me for many years. This valley came into existence in the 1930s, early, and we have been going on for about fifty, sixty years nearly. It is a place — personally, I feel — rather sacred and extraordinarily beautiful. Though rather dry earth, maybe a drought, but we human beings seem to survive all kinds of travail. And this place is primarily… came into existence for education. One may… One may be academically… excel, have good jobs, marry, settle down and have children and a family, but primarily what is most important in the world — not only in this valley but throughout the world — that we have a global mind, not a parochial mind, not a mind that is limited by nationalities, limited by religious orthodoxy, worn-out creeds, but rather have a mind that is capable of comprehension of the modern world, a world of technology, which is so fast advancing. And also a world where there is tremendous conflict between man and man, between ideologies, between beliefs, between dogmas, between religious creeds — there is always the threat of war — and also man throughout history has sought peace and peace seems to be so difficult to come by.

And, if we are educated properly, we not only face the academic, technological world, but also live within the psychological world with great clarity, with a great sense of affection, care, love, not only of nature but also of every other human being, whether he lives far away, many thousands of miles, or very close. And our education is the combination of wordly technological capacity and also to live a life of care, consideration, affection, a sense of sacred, religious responsibility. That’s why these schools exist.

I won’t speak anymore because the Prime Minister is here and I hope she will speak to you.

Indira Gandhi: I think it’s very unfair to ask me to speak after Krishnaji. You here, in this very lovely place, Rishi Place, are fortunate in having him come to stay with you and often to speak to you. I have just come this afternoon from the Kolar Gold fields — where we went this morning, from Delhi — and gold, as you know, is part of the nation’s wealth, but an ever greater wealth are people, but not every kind of people: people who are balanced enough to be able to take things in their stride. Krishnaji spoke of the travail of the technological confrontation, of other fighting and so on, on religion, on language, on so many other things, nationality… The true purpose of education — which he has spoken to you about much better than any words that I can find — is to be able to face all this with a balanced mind, and to remain yourself, not somebody else, however nice or however good that person may be. Each person has to be himself or herself. Now, it sounds very easy, but it’s very difficult to find that person, because each person has within him many different attitudes, in a way, many personalities, and it depends on you and your education which of those personalities will be allowed to come up and blossom; actually all of them should be allowed to come up, and then only one is a complete, whole, balanced, well-adjusted human being, who can have that responsible attitude of which Krishnaji spoke.

Some of our religious texts — the Gita, for instance, and others — they all say that you should try to be above pain and pleasure. But this doesn’t mean that you avoid them — you can’t avoid them, they are part of life; it doesn’t mean that you don’t feel them. It means that, feeling them, you still can regard them as part of life; just as when you go for a walk you may stumble on stones, you may get a thorn in your finger or your foot, if you’re bare-footed, but that doesn’t upset you very much. You say, ‘Well, this is part of this walk. I’m going to take out this thorn and I’m going to go ahead.’ Now, if you look at life in that way and if you are open to whatever is happening, because ultimately what is life, but what you… I mean, what are you is what you experience. A person who has shut up and has fewer experiences will be a lesser person, less able to be happy and less able to feel sorrow. And I think that what is important in a person is how much a person can feel, whether it is happiness or it is sorrow; the range of one’s feeling, just like in music: the wider the range, the more… the greater I think the music is.

So this is what one must try to be in life. We are, all of us are part of this earth; we are made of the same stuff as the earth, the trees, the rocks, all of this, we are more or less the same — the proportions differ, we look different, but basically we are the same — and after we are born and when we die, we become part of this great earth. So we should be open to all these influences. Krishnaji is a great teacher, but so are the trees, so are the breezes, so are all the other people of the village and the town, which you meet. What you get from a teacher is not what the teacher has, it’s what you are capable of taking from him. If you’re open to teaching, you are receptive to what is happening around you — which may not at that moment even seem important — then that becomes a part of you and you grow and develop, and I think you’re able to then meet the challenges of life.

In school, you have to face exams… I don’t know whether you have examinations here, but even if you don’t sit down and have regular examinations, life is full of exams; you are being tested all the time, and you have to decide yourself whether you are passing those tests. It’s not just a question of the marks that a teacher gives, but do you think that you have done your best? Do you do your best?

In the… A long, long time ago, my grandfather said to me that there are two kinds of people: there are those who do things and there are those who take the credit for it. He said, ‘Try and be in the first category, because there is far less competition.’

(Laughter)

So we must decide ourselves what we want to do, and do it with all the strength that we have in us. I think one thing is… Another thing is very important, and that is to try and like what you’re doing. If you don’t like it, if it’s a drudgery, you can’t do it well, and then you have tension in you, then you become unhappy and all kinds of problems arise. But if you try and find that however nasty the job is — if there is such a thing — is there anything in it that is interesting, that can appeal, and you search for that, then you will find that it’s easier to do it.

So I have just given you some of the things that I’ve learned from my experience; other people’s experiences may be different, and each of you will have to make of these experiences, and I hope that when you’re grown-up you will all be able to, not be satisfied with what you’ve done, because I think one should never be satisfied; one should always be trying to do something better. As the poet has said, ‘One’s reach must be beyond one’s grasp, otherwise one gets nowhere near heaven.’

So I’m… I have been thinking aloud, in a way, not giving a speech, but it’s been delightful to come here and to meet you all. It’s Rishi Valley, the trees and the gardens are beautiful, but equally beautiful are these eager, fresh faces before me. And I wish you all the best of luck in whatever you do. But I want to add something else — which is actually a Chinese saying — which is that, ‘Luck is not something that is outside. Luck also is inside you, and you must search it out and then it will help you as you go along.’

Thank you.